Why are graphic designers so underpaid

Yes and?

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  1. Yes and?

    Author: Photo bar 19.04.21 - 16:40

    After completing my studies as a graphic designer, I also "only" earn 32k gross a year. Completely underpaid.

    And yes, that is exactly and entirely my own problem! If I want more, I have to ask for more or go somewhere else.

    If you don't feel like getting so little money for carrying around stupid cardboard boxes, you should learn and practice something else. It's all a matter of supply and demand. For this reason, IT specialists / developers are often completely overpaid. If there were such capable ones as a dime a dozen, the developers would fight for jobs and not the other way around. -> supply and demand.

  2. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: Thunderbird1400 19.04.21 - 19:44

    That's exactly the case!

    But here in the forum something like this usually degenerates into a fundamental discussion about capitalism, as there are a few socialist / communist-influenced users who are critical or negative about capitalism and our entire model of life and want to impose their opinion on everyone until they other users turn away bored or resigned.
    Everyone should get the same amount and anyway, money should be abolished! And best of all work right away!

    These users are also not interested in exchanging views, only their point of view is correct. Either you take over the point of view or you are optionally a Nazi, environmental and human enemy, etc. and so on. Very easily. You don't need to discuss with such people, they are completely limited in their point of view and live in their own little world.

    The discussion culture in this forum is partly really disgusting and is in no way inferior to the discussions in the gossip press. Golem deliberately heats it up again and again with the same excitement issues such as salaries, electric drives, Tesla, certain parties, etc., where people then regularly get into each other's heads. Because excitement is known to bring clicks.



    Edited 2 times, last on 19.04.21 19:47 by Thunderbird1400.

  3. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: quineloe 19.04.21 - 19:47

    So you agree to pay more taxes in the near future (because Amazon won't) in order to raise all these low-wage earners to the subsistence level (possibly even with a premium because they worked so much)?

    Verified Top 500 Poster!

  4. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: LasseM 19.04.21 - 19:59

    Thunderbird1400 wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > It is exactly like that.
    >
    > But here in the forum something like this usually turns into a fundamental discussion around
    > Capitalism out because there are a few socialist / communist here
    > There are tinged users who support capitalism and ours in general
    > Critical to negative to each and every life model
    > want to impose their opinion until the other users are bored or
    > Resignedly turn away.
    > Everyone should get the same amount and anyway, money belongs
    > abolished! And best of all work right away!
    >

    The problem is that everyone is told from an early age that everything should be the same for everyone and no one is excluded. Peace, joy and pancakes.

    But that's not the case, everyone has the same (educationally) chances from the start, but does not guarantee that everyone has the right to success!

    You first have to understand and digest that in our snowflake society.

  5. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: mke2fs 19.04.21 - 20:31

    So I read something from salaries from 1800 (customer service) to a little over 2000 euros (packer).
    I do not know whether in this country you are now considered poor with 1800 euros gross, but those are the normal salaries that you earn in a call center, even where the people work who take care of your DSL connection.

    And I am almost certain that it is roughly what the journeymen go home with at the craftsmen.

  6. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: ChMu 19.04.21 - 20:31

    quineloe wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > So you agree to pay more taxes in the near future (because
    > Amazon will not) to all these low-income earners then on that
    > Subsistence level (possibly even with a premium because worked so much) too
    > lift?

    Amazon pays the taxes that are required of them. If the politicians knowingly regulate it that way, you cannot blame Amazon. Nobody, not me, not you and not Amazon, voluntarily pays more than they have to. I also only employ lawyers against the tax office in my company.
    The question arises, with what the state earns more, with 16,000 jobs which pay taxes again or the corporate tax which was explicitly designed to avoid the same. Without the jobs, the state, i.e. all of them, would have to provide for these 16,000 people. And Amazon or others move on in the caravan. Or do you think that German consumption cannot be served from Poland, Czechia or Bulgaria?
    It would be easy to adjust the tax laws accordingly, not only in Germany, worldwide. If it is not done, it will never come, just imagine, then the German corporations (there are some) would have to pay off all at once.
    No, easier to pick on the nasty foreigners.
    In addition, you would need politicians with back wheels who take responsibility, even in bad times. But that doesn't exist, preferring to vote on diets in the Bundestag or early pension claims, Vulgo Pfruende.
    The completely outdated and unsustainable pension system in Germany is another nail in the coffin. The German pension system is based on today's workers (let's call them the young) for the pensioners who are currently living (who have lived far too long) (let's call them the old ones, I am one of them). In a society that is aging and shrinking at the same time, this cannot go well for long. The system can only survive with an influx of young workers. There are of course plenty, in order to have Germany and the West in the general lifestyle, other states were mercilessly exploited, flooded with weapons in order to make war on themselves. So we have tons of refugees who of course would be good for work and pension payments, stupidly exactly these people are rejected by the locals (regardless of the nation).
    But these problems are for future generations, I no longer experience them. I feel sorry for the younger ones though. Infinite growth in a finite world was somehow not a great idea.

  7. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: quineloe 19.04.21 - 20:35

    ChMu wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > But these problems are for future generations, I no longer experience them. I feel sorry for the younger ones though.

    But not enough to do, right? Because it could be your wallet.

    Verified Top 500 Poster!

  8. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: ChMu 19.04.21 - 20:47

    quineloe wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > ChMu wrote:
    > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > -----
    >> But these problems are for future generations, I experience that
    > not anymore. I feel sorry for the younger ones though.
    >
    > But not enough to do anything, right? Because it could be yours
    > Purse go.

    What exactly should you do? Sell ​​stocks to boost Amazon pickers' salaries? Workers who are among the top 5% earners of the working people on the planet?

  9. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: KnutRider 19.04.21 - 20:52

    mke2fs wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > So I read something from salaries from 1800 (customer service) to something
    > over 2000 euros (packer).
    > I do not know whether you can now pay 1800 euros gross as a
    > Poor applies, but these are the normal salaries you get in a call center
    > so deserved, even in those people who work for yours
    > Take care of the DSL connection.
    >
    > And I am almost sure that it is roughly what the journeymen with
    > go home to craftsmen.
    So because people in the call center are also fed off, is that okay?

    Do you even know what is left over from 1800 € gross?

  10. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: crustaceans 19.04.21 - 21:19

    32K as a graphic designer isn't underpaid. This is a common salary in the industry. Unfortunately, you should avoid all media jobs. The wages are not much higher than at Norma or just like at Amazon. With a very good master's degree, my wife did not earn well either. She searched across the republic. More than 15 € / h was never possible. She's doing something new now.

    According to the government, one is poor with less than 1400 € in Berlin and less than 1942 € net in NRW (single household). Net!

    24K in Berlin / Brandenburg. Is not worth news. Almost everyone pays that.
    24K in North Rhine-Westphalia, Bavaria or BW is hard enough.

    And € 1800 is simply a scam. Even at Kaufland you get 2350 € per month as a warehouse assistant in North Rhine-Westphalia. That's not a great deal, but that's still reasonably okay. You can live with 1800 €. But you want to afford something and later feed children. Forget that with 1800 € gross.



    Edited 4 times, last on 19.04.21 21:31 by crustenscharbap.

  11. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: mke2fs 19.04.21 - 21:37

    KnutRider wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > mke2fs wrote:
    > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > -----
    >> So I read something from salaries from 1800 (customer service) to something
    >> over 2000 euros (packer).
    >> I do not know if you are now in this country with 1800 euros gross
    > as
    >> Poor applies, but these are the normal salaries you get in one
    > Call center
    >> so deserved, even in those people who work for yours
    >> Take care of the DSL connection.
    > >
    >> And I am almost certain that it is roughly what they are with
    > Journeyman
    >> go home to craftsmen.
    > Because people in the call center are also fed off, that's what it is
    > okay?
    >
    > Do you even know what is left over from 1800 € gross?


    Now go ahead, what's left of it?
    I now estimate 1500 euros net in tax class 1?
    Do you already realize that the income tax system is progressive?
    That pension insurance and health insurance are also lower?
    Or do you start from your 5000 euros a month and think someone with such a low salary will only get about half of it?
    You are wrong
    Incidentally, I started with 1,500 euros after my training, I think I got around 1,200 euros, so I have an idea of ​​what remains.

  12. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: mke2fs 19.04.21 - 21:39

    So if you want to build your life and your children on a temporary job and that as a sole earner (you only count on a salary) then you really have not understood something.

  13. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: Octavian 19.04.21 - 21:41

    > 32K as a graphic designer is not underpaid. That's one in the industry
    > usual salary. Unfortunately, all media jobs should be avoided
    > do.

    That was foreseeable. If a girl graduated from high school, was good at drawing, natural science solala, thought she was creative and had no other strengths, 30 years ago she wanted to study architecture. Today it's "something with the media".

    As a result, both architects and mediators generally earn very lousy.

  14. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: Photo bar 20.04.21 - 09:42

    crustenscharbap wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > 32K as a graphic designer is not underpaid. That's one in the industry
    > usual salary. Unfortunately, all media jobs should be avoided
    > do. The wages are not much higher than at Norma or just like at
    > Amazon. With a very good master’s degree, my wife did not do well either
    > earned. She searched across the republic. More than 15 € / h were never
    > inside. She's doing something new now.

    Yeah well I have now put it somewhat casually, because I now used the well-known generic term. Strictly speaking, I'm the Digital Art Director in Hamburg and I work out advertising campaigns for large international corporations that you probably know too. There should be more than 32k in there. But it's just a small advertising agency and I'm not (yet) a freelancer.

  15. Re: Yes, and?

    Author: Octavian 20.04.21 - 09:49

    > Yes, well. I have now put it somewhat casually because I now have the
    > took the well-known generic term. In fact, I'm digital art
    > Director in Hamburg and work on advertising campaigns for internationally active people
    > Large corporations that you probably know too. There should be more than 32k
    > be inside.

    Why? How do you fix that? Just the gut feeling that you somehow deserved it? Just because the total advertising budget is so big?

    Or you could just say "I won't do it for the sum" and leave. But you are well aware that there is no more anywhere else, and it is rather easy for your agency to find someone else who does the job just as well for 32k. I know that sounds tough, but the questions have to be answered honestly:
    1. Can I get more anywhere else?
    2. Are there others who would do my job equally well for the same salary?

    If you answer 1. with no and 2. with yes, you are in a difficult negotiating position.

    > But it's just a small advertising agency and I'm (still)
    > not a freelancer.

    That is the basic problem with "something with the media". The earnings are so low because the supply is so high. Small advertising agencies in Hamburg are a dime a dozen. I can find hundreds on Google alone. And there are even more freelancers and one-man agencies.

    The competition is merciless, the prices underground. I'm assuming that your agency boss doesn't earn a golden nose either, but has to calculate. It's just a difficult industry.

    And before jumping into self-employment, I would calculate with a sharp pencil, taking into account all ancillary costs, whether it is really worth it. When you are honest with yourself, freelance work is mostly self-exploitation.



    Edited 2 times, last on 04/20/21 09:56 by Oktavian.

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